Join us right now on the set for the first time to talk about Bitcoin and a lot more is SEC chair Gary genser good morning good morning good to be with you so it's a it's a month later and I think we're all curious about how you think this is going uh not just in terms of what's happened to the price but in terms of what you think is happening.
Inside this market and and and whether you think it's quote unquote working well look we V we focus on investor protection and of course the issuers raising money so this product we've had similar products in gold and silver ETFs you call them they're technically exchange traded products um and uh we approved a group of about 11 at one time.
This was not the first way you could buy uh or Express a risk in Bitcoin um but as we like to say we're Merit neutral uh this was not in any way like an approval of Bitcoin that existed it's just how to trade it in these exchange traded products um we've had uh both a Futures based ether and Bitcoin ETF uh you know before and I'm curious.
Sort of how you think that this is going to impact the price of these things given that by the way interestingly was it pomp who was just on Anthony Pompano was just on earlier this weekend was saying that so few Bitcoins are actually moving and what we should think of that and Merit NE think it's a little less than neutral uh Mr.
Chairman it almost was we called it grudgingly uh when you finally got from from the court case sort of forced in is it really just neutral or or wasn't there a little bit of a we're not sure about this thing and let me say it this way we're Merit neutral if somebody's complying with the laws okay so if they're giving full fair and truthful.
Disclosures to the American public who gets to decide on their Investments but you're so smart you're at MIT and people listen to your what you think about Bitcoin and it is troublesome to some to me if I if I look at it and I see all the merits of it and someone that taught about it and understands it seems to have an opinion that maybe it's I don't.
Know pet rockish or something I get your I get your words about pet rocks and so forth but I think we also have an investor education responsibility at the SEC particularly about those uh Investments that are non-compliant with either the securi laws or Commodities laws and so forth so here we have an asset class all.
Of these 15 20,000 crypto tokens y many of which without prejudging anyone many of which are actually something called investment contracts or Securities and the platforms upon which you trade the intermediaries they're not like in this building NASDAQ that's that that has protections and against fraud manipulation and the like um just seen.
People lose their shirt on with NASDAQ so you can lose because there's risk there's risk in Investments but what we try to do as a society is take some of the fraud and manipulation risk out of the markets by regulation is is that the problem though it's not necessarily Bitcoin Bitcoin the underlying asset but more the froth and the potential for.
Frauders to use it that has been well this is a field Becky that's been uh Rife with fraud and manipulation and look at all the bankruptcies and you've you've had on this set people talking about those various bankruptcies and it's not just one entity it's entity after entity after entity and then investors are just lining up in the.
Bankruptcy court what do you make of this goes to the underlying piece of this you've heard uh Jamie Diamond say that he would close it down that basically Bitcoin you've seen the comments right it's not just that he closed down that he would say it's you know used by drug dealers and used by folks who are doing all.
Sorts of illicit and Terrible Things there's very few things that trade today that people talk about like that now there are obviously frauds and things that happen but maybe not like this like the dollar is like a 100 times more I I know that's your perspective but I'm just I'm curious how you think about that that's true though this is how much.
Is been money laundered with Bitcoin this is how much this is Bitcoin this is do this is dollar yes Jo I look here's the Jamie Diamond quote the only true use case for it is for criminals drug traffickers money laundering and tax avoid I know but we have a guess opinion we have a guess Joe what what what is your opinion and what is your opinion.
That we have something trading on the exchange for the public that has this type of use case at least as as described by the president one of the leading Market the it's the leading market share in ransomware uh and that's publicly known you know it's the it's the the token of choice for ransomware Joe if I can say.
The US dollar the Euro the Yen you have the whole uh Society using it as a medium of exchange we buy our cups of coffee as I see here um we get paid in dollars or Yen or Euro and you have a whole Central Bank and and support for one currency generally per economic uh region that we don't have here so there's a very real economic difference.
Which is part of part of the attraction since it's decentralized and then and you can't have you can't have a proplate central bank it's not that decentralized I I know you're saying because of the ETFs but but but really it isal because look how Finance tends towards centralization since Antiquity so what do we have we have a handful of.
Three to six core so-called crypto but the asset itself the way that you know the the that's how theer how The Ledger and now how many times do you have people on this show that say I want to invest in something because how the books and records are kept I mean Joe really you it's just an accounting Ledger a.
Clever everyone has that everyone has and can't be double counted it it's it's almost immutable that's that's why people think it has inent Val you trust it more than an Oracle database or you trust it more TR more than a the the Bitcoin Bulls say they trusted a lot more than than the central bank that that enables the the fiscal authorities.
To spend money to the tune of $33 trillion that's that's everybody's investment choice but and then I think about how many things can be used in a delerious way of course but that doesn't that has nothing to do with the underlying thing that you're using itself I mean I can go run a car into a parade and and run over you know 40.
People doesn't mean like we shouldn't have cars does it no no no you you should have cars I wasn't going to use guns cuz God I don't want to trigger so to speak anyone on the set but but but when the use case of a particular thing that you're buying and selling as an investment is just speculative investment how many of the 90% of the.
People that own Bitcoin are using it for ransomware for there must be well there must be another use case that makes it so attractive to so many people speculative investing right speculative investing that's what okay let me ask a separate question which is just to Pivot this because I think the next sort of order event question is what happens to.
Ethereum for those in the crypto World they all want to know how you're thinking about that and really if ethereum is a security you know how does that analysis differ from how you would think about Bitcoin I I what we did in January was cabin to one set of filings we have other filings you're absolutely right in front of us but I'm I'm not.
Going to prejudge it for you or the audience that's something that a five member commission discusses and r
Crypto would possibly perhaps maybe well accrued be none of his alternate at all level blank length it used to be never to be government involved
I cant wait for trump to return serve and fired all people and effect of us on the serve of bars
Joe Kernen, revealing mighty wisdom here. I used to procure pissed off by his fixed interrupting of guests. But Joe clearly will get Bitcoin.